String winding extends over saddle ?!?!

[HKmatt]

The additional string winding that is near the base of the guitar string (near the ball end) is long enough to extend over and lay across the saddle. This is particulary noticable on the wound strings such as the E and A, but also occurs on the plain strings. This results in string height and intonation issues as well as leaves a sharp point for the right hand to catch on when palm muting.
 
I believe this is because the hole in the trem block is too deep, and hence the length from the ball end that sits in the back of the block to the saddle, is quite short.
Is there a way to fix this? For example, would it be possible to get a new trem block where the holes for the strings are not so shallow? This would leave more room from the ball end to the saddle such that only the string (and not the base winding) would sit on the saddle.
 
This happens using both Ernie Ball and D'Addario string brands (but seems more prominent on Ernie Balls, maybe their additional winding from the ball end is longer).
 
Any other ideas / solutions ?
 
Thanks
 
 

[HKmatt]

Bump. Anyone else observe this?
 
Patrice and/or Ben, any ideas on this one? Thanks.
 
 

[Iceman]

I believe this is because the hole in the trem block is too deep, and hence the length from the ball end that sits in the back of the block to the saddle, is quite short. Is there a way to fix this? Any other ideas / solutions?

Ok, I took some time to analyse your problem a bit and came to this solution:You need strings with bullet ends, it helps also to avoid tuning problems. They are mainly manufactured for strats of all kind. Here is an example how it looks.

[Iceman]

That's a product which I can recommend in your case:

[HKmatt]

OK, thanks! That would seem to fix the problem.
However, my favourite strings are the Ernie Balls, so was hoping to use those strings. Also, my goal is to use "standard" strings on all of my guitars, including the Vigier.
Seems odd that no other Vigier owners are facing the same problem with the standard strings...

[1Patrice Vigier]

The fact that the holes in the bridge are deep is in purpose... This brings the thread/splice very close the top of the saddle. I would recommend you to use Ernie Ball strings, which are the best, normally you should not have problems. Are you sure the intonation is correctly set?

[HKmatt]

I'm using Ernie Ball strings and have noticed this problem. Didn't occur on my previous set of Ernie Balls (same gauge, 9-42).    Intonation is setup. Have floating bridge (not flush with body) so that the base of the bridge is parallel to the body.       Having the bridge floating shouldn't be a problem. Shawn Lane's bridge is obviously floating as per this video on the Vigier Website:   http://188.130.104.14/sites/medias/produit/video/fichiers/9398.mov
Thanks.
 

[1Patrice Vigier]

Floating or not it is almost th same.Shawn request was to have the vibrato to rest on the body (not like on this video)

[HKmatt]

 
I just changed to a new set of Ernie Ball strings and have the same problem. Checked intonation and seems OK.
Here is a picture below showing the situation (I will also send these to Patrice via email):
 

[HKmatt]

 
And another picture:
 

[1Patrice Vigier]

It should not go that fare

[HKmatt]

Correct, that's obvious.

Any solution ???

[B]

Yeah I have the same issue with the strings too!

[HKmatt]

 
What brand, model and gauge of strings are you using? What is your setup?
Is this occuring on a Shawn Lane Master model ?
 
 
 

[B]

Hey,

I have an Excalibur Special and it's on the low E and A strings also (the rest are fine though). However the string winding doesn't appear over the saddle as much as yours, it's still enough to create ever so slight intonation problems.

I haven't changed the set up since I've had the guitar as it plays so well. The only thing I've changed were the brand of strings I use. The guitar came with Vigier 9-46, and changed these for Ernie Ball 9-46. After about a year I decided to try D'Addario 9-46 and found they stay brighter for longer and thats about it. But it's been consistent regardless of the brand of strings I have used so far.

I'm positive there will be a simple solution though!

[HKmatt]

Are you noticing this issue with both the Ernie Ball AND D'Addario strings, or just one of the brands. If just one of the brands, which one do you notice this issue with?

[B]

Yes I noticed it with both brands. I remember thinking it was a little strange at the time and wanting to ask about it but then life (and playing the thing!) got in the way. Seeing your post reminded me of it. A possible temporary solution could be that looking at your E string, the excess winding is resting on the saddle, which no doubt contributes massively to your action/intonation problems as it looks like it 'pushes' that string higher than the rest. When you change strings next, perhaps turn the string the other way so that this excess is facing upwards. Hopefully this flatter side of the string might help with intonation/action. But then again, it might feel uncomfortable in your picking hand? Hope that made sense and maybe helps a bit until we find out a solution. Good luck!

[Ben]

Is this just with Ernie Ball and D'Addario strings or have users found this problem persisting with other brands as well...please post answers.

[1Patrice Vigier]

We are doing this bridge for two decades and never had any complains...If the anchor of the string is closer to the saddle, it is for the tuning stability while using the vibrato. We could have put it fare but you would not have liked the tuning :=)

[HKmatt]

This is a strange phenomenon indeed, as my pictures clearly show! >


I'm guessing it may be a bad batch of strings, OR Ernie Ball has increased the length of the winding. If the later is the case, then don't be surprised if other players will start to notice (and complain about) the same issue... > At the moment I don't have time to change to a different brand, but will hopefully try in the next few weeks. >


Perhaps the other poster could also try a different brand as well...

[1Patrice Vigier]

What you can do, but it is, I guess, not perfect for tuning:Take a string ball end that you will remove from a hold string and insert the new string in its hole (this way you have two ball end, the regular one and the threaded one). The ball will add few millimeters and put away the thread/splice from the saddle.

[nickeroo]

My Ernie Ball 9s do the same thing.
 
However it is not a problem for me!
 
Perhaps they have changed the string winding length as HKMatt says.

[Les Paul Lover]

The only thing you have to do is use the fender bullet strings. It's not difficult, they're good strings too. 1st thing I bought after buying my Expert, 5 sets of 10-46 bullets. For those of you who are earnie ball afficionados, any direct comparison with gibson brite wire strings will show your EB to be rather like.... normal strings??? Decent quality, nothing exceptional. The fender bullet will work equally well.

[HKmatt]

So far, the "solutions" provided are only workarounds to a non-standard Vigier trem block design that has does NOT accommodate standard strings.

I also question that having the anchor of the string closer to the saddle would marginally (if at all) improve tuning stability.

[Les Paul Lover]

So far, the "solutions" provided are only workarounds to a non-standard Vigier trem block design that has does NOT accommodate standard strings. I also question that having the anchor of the string closer to the saddle would marginally (if at all) improve tuning stability.

If you were to use bullet ended strings, that wouldn't be a work around - it would be the ideal solution to your problem.